Home » Audio » General » Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online
Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2696] Mon, 30 January 2006 23:07 Go to next message
Duke is currently offline  Duke
Messages: 297
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
Earl has recently posted the fourth chapter of his forthcoming book online.

Earl looks at measurements from the point of view of the loudspeaker designer, rather than that of the marketing department. Most real-world measurements that give genuinely useful information will probably never be seen by us because they look awful compared to the oversmoothed on-axis curves that have been our steady diet for years now. Earl examines many different measurement techniques and topics.

Of enormous interest to me was the information on polar response, directivity index, and power response. As you will see, Wayne has been barking up the right tree all along with his emphasis on matching up the directivity indices. He's taking an acoustic solution, which is worlds better than relying on equalization alone because equalization cannot fix problems that are fundamentally acoustic.

In particular, take a look at Figure 4-6 and Figure 4-10. The first shows two very similar-looking on-axis response curves. The second is the power response curves for the same two speakers. As you will see, the problems introduced by inattention to directivity issues are huge, way beyond what a bit of digital EQ can begin to address.

Enjoy!

Duke



Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2697 is a reply to message #2696] Tue, 31 January 2006 08:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

Neat stuff. Ask Earl if he'd like to do a seminar at the Great Plains Audiofest this year. I've already booked the conference room and we'd love to have Earl speak. And be sure and ask Lori to bring more of those cool vapor lamps!


Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2700 is a reply to message #2696] Wed, 01 February 2006 07:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
akhilesh is currently offline  akhilesh
Messages: 1275
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (3rd Degree)
Looks good, Duke. I was wondering if the issue of correlation of measurements to subjective likes and dislikes is touched on in the chapter. In other words, if certain measurements don;t seem to have any impact on subjectie liking or disliking (in exxence are "inaudible") then should we be pursuing them.
I find that aspect fascinating. I know Floyd Toole did a lot of work in this area. I was wondering if this issue is addressed by Earl.
thanks
-akhilesh


Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2701 is a reply to message #2700] Wed, 01 February 2006 15:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Duke is currently offline  Duke
Messages: 297
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
Hi Akhilesh,

Earl focuses more on measurements as a means to get enough useful information about what a loudspeaker is really doing, but he does give some interesting psychoacoustic information along the way regarding audibilty of THD and group delay. Apparently loudness level plays a significant role in the ear's detection of distortion. But Earl doesn't talk about things like how the skewing the frequency response or power response this way or that is perceived.

One of the concepts that was new to me is "Transfer Characteristic", or TC, which (if I understand) is basically all of the changes that a loudspeaker does to the input signal. It's very complicated and varies with both frequency and loudness level. Earl does talk about the relative audibility of distortions as they relate to the transfer characteristic. Apparently looking at (and understanding the psycohacoustic implications of) the transfer characteristic predicts that soft clipping is subjectively benign while hard clipping is quite objectionable, and that the very small glitch in Class A/B amplifier operation as the voltage swings through the zero point ("crossover distorton") is especially irritating.

Duke

Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2702 is a reply to message #2697] Wed, 01 February 2006 15:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Duke is currently offline  Duke
Messages: 297
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
Will do, thanks Wayne! I don't think Earl is planning to attend, but we'll see.

Duke

Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2704 is a reply to message #2701] Wed, 01 February 2006 20:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
akhilesh is currently offline  akhilesh
Messages: 1275
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (3rd Degree)
THanks Duke!
-akhilesh

Re: Earl Geddes chapter on Measurements now online [message #2705 is a reply to message #2702] Wed, 01 February 2006 22:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

I'm anxious to see you and Lori, hopefully Earl will fly in too. Good friends, good tunes, we'll definitely have some fun. And the goodwill that comes from it is enormous.


Chapter on perception [message #2759 is a reply to message #2700] Fri, 17 February 2006 15:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Earl Geddes is currently offline  Earl Geddes
Messages: 220
Registered: May 2009
Master
There is going to be a chapter on perception. How we p[erecieve sounds and what aspects of design and mesasurements are impacted by how we perecive sound. This will be an important chapter because th8is is hardly ever discussed, but critically important.

Like don't waste your time with THD measurements - things like that.

Re: Chapter on perception [message #2762 is a reply to message #2759] Fri, 17 February 2006 17:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
akhilesh is currently offline  akhilesh
Messages: 1275
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (3rd Degree)
Sounds good Earl.
Look forward to it.
I think what is critically missing is an article that simultaneously:
a) is based on, and cites, peer reviewed studies that have been published in journals or proceedings,
b) is readable by advanced hobbyists with limited technical background
c) presents a comprehensive list of measurements that actually do effect subjective perception (again backed up by real studies).
Such an article would be very difficult to write, and has not been done because of the abundance of comerical interests and scientifially challenged manufacturers/dealers, not to mention reviewers.

Peter Aczel attempted such articles many times, and I think came quite close, though he pretty mcuh only cited his own & his associate's experiences, and his data was never published anywhere, except the audio critic of course. To hi credit, he is the only person I know who actually introduced scientists like Floyd Toole to the general audience.

thanks
-akhilesh

Re: Chapter on perception [message #2765 is a reply to message #2759] Sat, 18 February 2006 10:32 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

I think what you're saying is that the term "total harmonic distortion" is somewhat ambiguous, so measurements of this value don't mean much. They don't tell us what levels of each harmonic is present, just the combined total. If that's what you mean, I think maybe I'd agree that an ambiguous number is a waste of time.

But to me, harmonic distortion is one of the most offensive commonly occuring anomalies created by audio reproduction equipment. The most offensive is response anomalies. Things like a complete loss of treble or a large peak in the midrange, that sort of thing. That bothers me the most. But clipping is definitely high on the "ugly" list, and it is characterized by exaggerated amounts of odd harmonics.

Certainly, low levels are imperceptible. I doubt anyone can hear a response anomaly of 0.1dB and few can hear 1dB, but most everyone can hear a 10dB swell or dip in a particular band. Midrange is easier to notice, just like the phon curve shows. Same must be true of distortion. Probably nobody can hear harmonics that are -50dB, but -10dB is another matter. And same as the phon curve, the band which harmonics fall in is important, as is their relation to the fundamental.

So what I'm saying is that I think reductions in harmonic distortion are some of the best improvements one can make in an audio system. The figure of "total harmonic distortion" might not be particularly relevant, but I am certain that moderate to high distortion levels are very offensive, and probably one of the worst things a component in an audio system can cause.


Previous Topic: Question for Wayne about Great Plains
Next Topic: Room treatment
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Mon Dec 23 12:45:34 CST 2024

Sponsoring Organizations

DIY Audio Projects
DIY Audio Projects
OddWatt Audio
OddWatt Audio
Pi Speakers
Pi Speakers
Prosound Shootout
Prosound Shootout
Miller Audio
Miller Audio
Tubes For Amps
TubesForAmps.com

Lone Star Audiofest