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2 Pi Efficiency Question [message #39026] Tue, 12 November 2002 17:09 Go to next message
rufus is currently offline  rufus
Messages: 2
Registered: May 2009
Esquire
I'm interested in the 2 Pi's and was wondering about their true efficiency. Currently, I use Klipsch RB5's that are rated at 96db, but are really about 91.7db (Audio magazine-next to last issue). I know that 91.7db is closer to the truth and have read elsewhere that Klipsch used a very advantageous measurement method to get 96db (for the entire Reference Series). Trying a pair of 2 Pi would be warranted if they really did come close to their rating. Do you feel the 2 Pi's are as near efficient as their rating? Thanks.
Re: 2 Pi Efficiency Question [message #39027 is a reply to message #39026] Tue, 12 November 2002 18:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
steve f is currently offline  steve f
Messages: 236
Registered: May 2009
Master
Hi Rufus,
In a word, yes. I built my son a pair of one Pi's, which are similar. Pi speakers work as advertised. You will be pleased.
Steve
Re: 2 Pi Efficiency Question [message #39028 is a reply to message #39026] Tue, 12 November 2002 18:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BillEpstein is currently offline  BillEpstein
Messages: 886
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (2nd Degree)
I can't speak to the numbers, big surprise, but I can tell you that with a 30 watt solid waste receiver I can't turn the volume control past 9 o'clock. With the 2.5 watt Paramours, the neighbors call the police at about 11:00.
In both cases remarkably similar to the volume levels of the 4's.
12X28X8 room. Concrete floors, cheap carpet and cracker box walls and ceiling.
2 Pi Efficiency Answer [message #39030 is a reply to message #39026] Tue, 12 November 2002 19:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18680
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

Here's the "straight scoop" about sensitivity ratings for π Speakers and others. Like power may be described in terms of peak power or RMS, sensitivity has some descriptive qualifiers too.

Here are some of the things that should be specified:

1. Where is the measurement taken? Even when specifying 1 meter, is that 1 meter from the horn mouth, baffle or voice coil?
2. What spatial condition does the speaker radiate into?
3. Is 2.83vRMS the input signal, or is it a signal that causes the dissipation of 1 watt?
4. What frequency or range of frequencies is used?
5. If a range of frequencies is used, is the range averaged? Are resonance or breakup modes included in the average?

The answer to these questions can quite literally give 10dB difference in sensitivity, and I'm not exaggerating. This is actually a low figure, because just the difference of free space to eighth space represents 9dB. The difference of mid-band to resonance, either mass resonance or upper bound (breakup mode) is also often 10dB. So the difference between low-midband in free space and resonant output in eighth space may actually be closer to 20dB.

All π Speakers are designed for either quarter-space (one, two, three and four π speakers) or eighth-space (five, six, and seven π cornerhorn speakers). So if the speakers are placed where they are intended, they'll be either 3dB or 6dB higher than half-space measurements indicate, depending on the model. This is significant because Eminence measures their components with an accurate new Klipple system in an improved, larger sound chamber. They are doing a good job at providing us with accurate measurements with this equipment, and their data shows performance in half space.

That brings me to the point of your question, which is the sensitivity of two π speakers. What we see for the Alpha 10 - which is used in the two π and two π tower - is approximately 94dB from low frequency cutoff up to 1kHz, where output begins to rise. It is also at this point that an inductor in the two π design starts to attenuate high frequencies, so increased output in this region should not be used for averaging. So the speaker in half space would actually only be a 94dB speaker, but since you should put it in quarter space for best performance, you can also expect it to provide 97dB at one meter, with one watt of input power.

Re: 2 Pi Efficiency Question [message #39031 is a reply to message #39026] Tue, 12 November 2002 19:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Matts is currently offline  Matts
Messages: 359
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
I have Two Pis in a med.-large room (abt.14'x20') w/9ft ceiling and am currently playing the same little 2.5-3.5 watt amps Till E. has (although maybe not wired quite as nice!) and they rock the house down. Can play all types of music w/ great bass response. Full volume is uncomfortable and I like loud music. Have them in quarter space- in a floor/wall junction, about 3 feet from the corner.
Spaces?? [message #39050 is a reply to message #39030] Wed, 13 November 2002 18:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
rufus is currently offline  rufus
Messages: 2
Registered: May 2009
Esquire
I remember reading somewhere that my speakers were rated in 1/8 space. Being described as being set on the floor in a corner. So, a 1/4 space would be in a corner on a stand? Is that basically the idea?
Re: Spaces?? [message #39051 is a reply to message #39050] Wed, 13 November 2002 19:06 Go to previous message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18680
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

Yes, that's right. You can also achieve quarter-space by placement against the wall and on the floor, but set away from the corner. Same can be done up in the ceiling; The thing that defines quarter-space is the junction of two right planes and eighth-space is a corner built with three right planes.

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