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Subjective Performance? [message #37559] Mon, 29 July 2002 14:01 Go to next message
Farb Sklarb is currently offline  Farb Sklarb
Messages: 6
Registered: May 2009
Esquire
Can someone give a balanced subjective evaluation of the various speakers in the Pi line, as well as a brief comparison with competing types of speakers? I'm intrigued by what I see here, and impressed by the enthusiasm of the group, but a bit concerned about making a major investment in speakers that sound like, well, JBL horns. FWIW, I'm mainly interested in classical music. Imaging and audiophile tricks are less important to me than faithful tone, freedom from listener fatigue, and a sense of liveness.

Thanks in advance.

You shouldn't post under your real name! (nt) [message #37564 is a reply to message #37559] Mon, 29 July 2002 15:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
LuxmanLover is currently offline  LuxmanLover
Messages: 164
Registered: May 2009
Master
HEHEHEHEHEHE
As the Elder Statesman of the group, it 'hooves me on this 'spicious 'casion.. [message #37566 is a reply to message #37559] Mon, 29 July 2002 18:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BillEpstein is currently offline  BillEpstein
Messages: 886
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (2nd Degree)

to relate that I have owned, in chronological order, KLH 17's, ADS whatsis's, Bose 901's, YES, Bose 901's, Rogers Ls5a's, the very first mini-monitors, those shiny black things, Paladins???, Acoustat 1+1's, NHT 2's, Meadowlark Kestrels and now Theatre 4 Pi's.

The KLH and ADS were in a dorm and a cottage and I was in a hallucigenic state so they don't count. But the Firesign Theatre sounded really good. With marriage and respectability the Bose graced the L.R. Say what you want, when I auditioned them against the newly arrived Floyd O'Toole speakers from Canada using the voice of Joan Sutherland as a measure, they sounded more musical. The Rogers were on loan and a fad. Like looking down E.Schwarzkopf's throat. The shiny black jobs were also on loan and were the first speaks where image came into play. But nothing below 80 Hz. The Acoustats were the first I truly loved and paired with similar quality components (analog). Flat but accurate side to side image, tonal purity and razor sharp attacks and transients. Delicate when necessary, brassy too. The post divorce NHT's were ultra sonic nightmares! The Kestrels seemed to combine the best qualities of everything, strong bass, really great Schwarzkopf and Sutherland mid-range, delicate highs, probably the very best John Williams guitar speaker ever. Yeah, this is long but on point. keep reading!

My musical perspective is conditioned by sitting in the back row of many orchestras and bands from grade school thru Interlochen to major university, pit orchestras, big band "combo-orks" etc etc. I've been conducted by and accompanied with Glenn Gould, Frederick Fennell,William Krafft, Eunice Podis, and Van Cliburn. Oh yeah, I was sawing away on a Trombone. Studied with a Cleveland orchestra member and attended countless Thurs dress rehearsals. So Classical is my bag and I like to be immersed in the music. I also want to hear it if the percussionist forgets to release the snares on the field drum and the entrance of the Tuba excites them. I know what "distortion" occurs when a soprano or tenor overloads a hall and I want to hear that. There has to be instant recognition of Oboe from English Horn from Bassoon, not always easy. Kestrel sucked at that. So did the Bose. So all the dynamic speakers with the exception of the Rogers and NHT's rolled off the details and they were wierd. The Acoustats were magical but had little weight (Dynamics and bass). You think the Kestrels are better than they are but they're not. Although good.

Now we listen to the Pi's for the first time. First, the faults: the upper reaches of the Delta woofer from 800 to 1600 Hz where the woodwinds and brass live don't have the resolving power to be dead on the timbre and tone of the instrument. But close. That's why I'll ultimately be building Pro's. Now the strengths: The most amazing you-are-there presentation of every recording venue from nightclubs to Severance Hall to the Plains above the Hudson River (Mercury 1812, bigod!). Weight you can wear about your shoulders and feel in your knees. Listen to the trombone fugue in the third movement of Brahm's First Symphony, it's so right. Or the entrance of the tutti brass in the later part of P.I.'s "Romeo and Juliet". Or the bass drum in the last movement of Part's Third symphony. Growling string bass or fender bass. It's all there. Ohmigod imaging with the speakers in the corner of the room where audiophools say they don't belong. Tympani out in the driveway. And female voices whether Emma Kirkby or Joni Mitchell or Sinead O'Connor, wow! Chestiness, horn shout? WTF? it isn't there.

I was at the Horn Fest and heard the Valencias, nice, the Magnetar set-up, the Classic T-1 and 3, loved the T-1 and of course, Bruce Edgars salad bowls. Magnetar couldn't stay in his chair for a minute without tweaking something so I left and Dr. Bruce was playing scratchy 78's and I left. I came home that night, schlepped the Pi's inside, hooked'em up and the music was back. And they cost under a grand built, under $600 if you DIY. What was the question again?

Q&A for Elder Statesman [message #37567 is a reply to message #37566] Mon, 29 July 2002 20:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RJW is currently offline  RJW
Messages: 29
Registered: May 2009
Chancellor

You're going to do the pros, ultimately. Have you heard the omegas or the kilomaxs(?)? Nice history by the way, old man! :^)
Ron

Re: As the Elder Statesman of the group, it 'hooves me on this 'spicious 'casion.. [message #37575 is a reply to message #37566] Tue, 30 July 2002 11:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Farb Sklarb is currently offline  Farb Sklarb
Messages: 6
Registered: May 2009
Esquire

Thanks for the info. It sounds great, of course. Preferences are personal and I still have a certain amount of healthy skepticism. But I think the most compelling aspect of the project is that it's something new and different, especially from the Magneplanars I have right now. If I weren't so darned broke! I've gotta take some cues from those Enron and Worldcom execs and figure out how to bleed off cash from the family budget without my wife finding out.

Re: As the Elder Statesman of the group, it 'hooves me on this 'spicious 'casion.. [message #37579 is a reply to message #37566] Tue, 30 July 2002 14:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tomwh is currently offline  Tomwh
Messages: 1
Registered: May 2009
Esquire
Hi Till:

I have to assume Pink Floyds the Wall would be great? How about Jazz and Tom Waits???????

Tom Waits For No Man [message #37581 is a reply to message #37579] Tue, 30 July 2002 15:11 Go to previous message
BillEpstein is currently offline  BillEpstein
Messages: 886
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (2nd Degree)

Never heard that gentleman but oh those alarm clocks!

Dynamics are for sure the forte of the Pi's. Dynamics and musical timbre. That they give you such great positining and spacing of the instruments is just frosting. Listen to Robert Merrill pacing across the stage in Tosca.

Paul Desmond and Coltrane and J.J. Johnson are a treat. Does anyone have the Harry James, "King James Edition" on Reference Recordings? That's a showpiece!

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