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New woofer upgrade options [message #75973] Sat, 23 March 2013 16:36 Go to next message
dheflin44 is currently offline  dheflin44
Messages: 47
Registered: November 2012
Location: Carrollton, TX
Baron
Wayne,

Have you looked at the new B&C 15FW76? It replaces the discontinued 15PS76, but also adds an aluminum shorting ring to control Le and reduce midrange distortion. Also it's less than half the price of a new 2226H.

-Darrell
Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #75975 is a reply to message #75973] Sat, 23 March 2013 19:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

Yes, I looked at that driver and other B&C midwoofers, very recently, as a matter of fact. I always keep my eyes open. I am currently re-evaluating my driver choices for the high-end stuff, so as I said, I've been looking at drivers very recently.

But the 2226H is a top-notch driver that I have no reason to replace.

Everyone else is in catch-up mode on that one, in my opinion, and they all have been ever since JBL introduced the 2205 over 30 years ago now. The 2205 was what I used in the 1980s, the 2225 in the 1990s and the 2226 ever since. Haven't ever found anything that beat that driver family. I'm always looking, but always end up sticking with it.

Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #76037 is a reply to message #75973] Wed, 27 March 2013 16:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dheflin44 is currently offline  dheflin44
Messages: 47
Registered: November 2012
Location: Carrollton, TX
Baron
Wayne,

In the meantime, what do you think of the Definimax?

Thanks,
Darrell
Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #76039 is a reply to message #76037] Wed, 27 March 2013 17:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

I like it. I like it a lot, actually. I still have to dial it in, but I have already done enough testing to know it is suitable.

It sounds a lot like the TD12S version from about 200Hz up, but I must admit the TD12S version has more bottom end. The Definimax upgrade is more like the Delta version with respect to low end. It's much like all my other models, needing a sub for a full foundation. But it does have clearer vocals, in my opinion, than the Delta and that's the real goal of the upgraded drivers, so I think it will serve in that capacity very well.

One thing I always like to do with my high-end stuff past simple measurements is a long-term listening evaluation. I really like to live with a speaker for a few months, and to find time to listen to it non-stop for several days. That's a real good litmus test for me: Listen to a speaker for a long time and see how much listener fatigue I feel.

All my speakers sound really clear and undistorted, so on a casual listen the standard drivers sound almost as good as the upgraded ones. The upgrades sound clearer, but not night and day clearer, just a little bit. But the better drivers won't give me temporary tinitus nearly as much as the lesser drivers after high-power usage and/or lengthy exposure. I can go to a trade show and listen to the 2226 versions of my speakers all weekend long and still feel refreshed and ready to listen some more when it's time to go home. If a driver can't do that, I won't keep it on the upgrade list.

Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #76041 is a reply to message #76039] Wed, 27 March 2013 19:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
horndawg is currently offline  horndawg
Messages: 1
Registered: May 2012
Location: United States
Esquire

Wayne Parham wrote on Wed, 27 March 2013 17:37
One thing I always like to do with my high-end stuff past simple measurements is a long-term listening evaluation. I really like to live with a speaker for a few months, and to find time to listen to it non-stop for several days. That's a real good litmus test for me: Listen to a speaker for a long time and see how much listener fatigue I feel.

I will agree with you on this, 100 percent. I have come to realize for some time now, that if a new speaker (or any component for that matter) grabs my attention because of something that on first impression it seems to do very well, this same attribute more often than not, will prove tiring and a liability in the long term.

That's why I always do what you just described and listen over the long haul in order to truly get a handle on the speaker's sound. For me that's the only way to go about it and be confident in my assessments and that's also the reason I don't give much basis to peoples' enthusiastic reviews of components with only a week's worth of listening.

Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #76073 is a reply to message #75973] Fri, 29 March 2013 04:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AnthonyD is currently offline  AnthonyD
Messages: 1
Registered: March 2013
Esquire
Wayne,

Just out of interest why don't you use 2206H as an upgrade for the 3pi? Its not a bass demon but almost perfect response and very low distortion plus all the usual JBL qualities.
Re: New woofer upgrade options [message #76079 is a reply to message #76073] Fri, 29 March 2013 10:18 Go to previous message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18793
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

I designed and tested two different prototype loudspeakers that used the JBL 2206, but neither one really did what I wanted. I love the 2206 as a midrange, but don't care for it so much as a midwoofer. Even though all of my designs are best used with subs, I'm still kind of particular that the mains reach frequencies below 100Hz.

I like smoothing the mains with flanking subs, effectively making a 2.5-way with the helper woofer detached. This approach requires the mains to generate some bass. It doesn't have to be deep bass, it can be a little rolled off, but it can't be rolled off above 100Hz.

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