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Re: 2 B A Drug Addict in NO [message #56857 is a reply to message #56852] |
Mon, 05 September 2005 09:22 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/down.png) |
cheetah
Messages: 70 Registered: May 2009
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Viscount |
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Government is inept at all levels. When this is over and people begin to take the aftermath and response apart and analyse them; not Bush, not Blanco, not Nagin. All levels of government failed here. That has been my point all along. I don't see pointing a finger at any one individual and saying why didn't you do more? What took so long? And what of the people who refused to go? Yes there were some who could not. Those who were/are sick, infirmed, the old and feeble, the young who are wards of the state, the list goes on. I saw yesterday that over 230,000 had been evacuated from NO. And only God knows how many more they will find, when they start going door to door. You simply can't make a case that this many people simply couldn't find a way out. No, a very large number a people chose to stay: the reasons are varied and their own: and ride this one out. They gamble with their lives and lost. My heart breaks because of the conditions these people had to endure. But the fault is their own. I guess what I am saying is this. We, you, me, all of us are damn idiots if we are depending on the government to take care of us. Ultimately I am responsible for my self. Not the mayor. Not the governor. Not the president. ME! If it had been my family, and we had the advanced notice of what was coming, you can bet that I would have gotten them us out. Some way some how. Even if I had to walk. I would have gotten my brood out. Those who could not help them selves, Yes; we as a society have a responsiblitiy to help. We didn't. Our social services failed. Government failed. We all failed to make preparation for what we all knew was coming, eventually. Bottom line. If I allow government to have the responsibility for my welfare and safe keeping, then there is much personal freedom I must also relinquish. No one can be saddled with responsibility without the authority to back it up. Be it government or private individuals. Since government is enept, as the response to Katrina so vividly illustrates, I will not depend on them for the well being of mine. I will look after them. But, I also need to get government out of my life, to allow me to do the things I need to do, to prepare. The debate in this country needs to change. We are missing the point as we all discuss how and why the government response failed. The debate should be who is more able to protect me and mine when disaster comes. Government, all levels? Hardly! Joe
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Re: 2 B A Drug Addict in NO [message #56865 is a reply to message #56864] |
Tue, 06 September 2005 12:10 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/down.png) |
Manualblock
Messages: 4973 Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (13th Degree) |
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So; AK what is the definition of a leader? Do they not exist anymore? Was Abraham Lincoln a server or a leader? George Washington? How about Mohandus Ghandi? I got it; a leader is one who takes orders??Where I grew up there were guys you knew were men. They were the guys you wanted around you if something went wrong or needed doing. They had some characteristics in common with each other. They tended to be capable; quick thinking and resourcefull. And when something went wrong..they accepted the responsibility and corrected the situation. Then there were guys known around to be weasels. They were always bragging about their supposed accomplishments that were non-existant; you could not trust their word to be true or accurate; they never finished what they started or they screwed up the things they did do then tried to blame it on someone else. And when the shit hit the fan they either disappeared or provided excuses instead of help.
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Re: 2 B A Drug Addict in NO [message #56867 is a reply to message #56864] |
Wed, 07 September 2005 03:25 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/forum/theme/AudioRoundTable/images/down.png) |
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Wayne Parham
Messages: 18754 Registered: January 2001
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Illuminati (33rd Degree) |
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I see that as an idealistic position, and I agree. The best organizations I know of treat their office positions as trusted servants, and they encourage rotation of position. There's a certain learning curve for a new person in a position, then a period where they are comfortable and most effective, then a burnout period. By rotating the position, the organization is made stronger because more people become more involved. It also protects the organization from institutionalized leadership, which is almost always a power grab. I don't know if it would work on a national level though. Seems to work best on a smaller local level, where everyone knows everyone else.One thing is certain. No matter how much you try to institutionalize safety, it's still just layers and layers of abstraction over a fundamental level of uncertainty. What I mean is, you can build social systems with insurance against catastrophe, but you cannot ensure safety. You can do a lot to help things, and you can think ahead. But you cannot ensure a person's safety, health or prosperity. Not that I think we should stop trying to do the best we can, but I think it is important to do a reality check. The worst thing I see out of the last 50 years or so is people have become so accustomed to cradle-to-grave security that they believe they can actually demand it. We tend to forget that social systems are there to protect society, not individuals. Each individual has to protect himself, and one forgets this at his own peril. I'm not saying I think everyone should fend for themselves, and forget those that can't. Not at all. But I am reminding everyone of this simple fact. The police that catch the robber isn't there to protect your stuff, in fact, he could care less. The police are there to protect society by acting as a deterrent, to frighten bad guys into acting like good guys. He is also a sometimes a tax collector of sorts, bringing in revenues for the city, state or federal agency he works for. Same is true of the military, National Guard, etc. They aren't there to protect anyone. They are there to protect everyone. So if you are under attack, hurt, hungry or thirsty, by all means, do the best you can. Don't wait for the cops or the National Guard because they might not help you. That's not their job. Weird, I know, very frustrating. But just have your house burgled or your car stolen and you'll see what I mean. Be attacked and mugged. See what happens if your kids are kidnapped. Or have a natural disaster destroy your life. That's when I think it's time for us to go above and beyond the system, to reach out as individuals to other individuals. Because the system isn't setup to help individuals, and those that think otherwise become hopelessly frustrated.
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