Re: PS Transformers [message #9744 is a reply to message #9740] |
Sun, 30 July 2006 20:44 |
Forty2wo
Messages: 163 Registered: May 2009
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Master |
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It seems to me that you are falling down the wokie hole. "Building the very best amp on the green earth on the first try" This is the road to madness, or at least inaction. I, and… can I get a show of hands here, been there. Let’s say for the 6AH4 amp we were discussing a while back. At a guess you need
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Re: PS Transformers [message #9745 is a reply to message #9743] |
Mon, 31 July 2006 06:08 |
Damir
Messages: 1005 Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (2nd Degree) |
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Simplest - we have two devices "chained" together, 2nd "sees" output (or source) impedance of the 1st device on its input. For example, if 2nd device is a preamp, and 1st is a pot, then preamp "sees" output resistance of the pot in series on its input. We can describe the pot as a one resistor in series, and one resistor in parallel to the source. Then output resistance of the pot is the parallel combination of those two resistors. If our pot is half-opened 10k device, then its output (or series, or source) resistance (that preamp "sees" in series with its input) is 5k//5k = 2k5. Power suplies filters are more complicated - they have resistors, but also capacitors and inductors - they have impedance (say, frequency-dependent resistance to AC). Formulas for output impedances of various filters (Pi-type,CLC, for example) you can find elsevere, RDH comes to my mind... But, fortunately, large knowledge of network theory isn`t necessary for building a PS...
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Re: PS Transformers [message #9750 is a reply to message #9749] |
Wed, 02 August 2006 22:22 |
Forty2wo
Messages: 163 Registered: May 2009
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Master |
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When I composed that message, I meant to change the title to "On hand is good". I forgot. Without it, it changes the tone of the post. It was meant as a "use what you got" rather than "Just get on with it" Over at AA there was a long discussion on the merits of low DSR chokes, that moved on to power transformers. At first I thought the thread had promise. Well silly me. Also it has been very hot here and with little or no AC. Perhaps I am a bit cranky.(No miserable little smile face) So. After your very considered reply, I reread the thread. To go back to your original question, low verses high DSR. I can not think of a reason that you would want a high DSR secondary in a SE amp. Does this mean that that the transformer with the lowest possible DSR is always the best? Good question. I have not looked at it in those terms, Two points. First, remember, a transformer can be drawn ‘as a black box that is full of compromises’ (I rather like that one;) Second, if you go and order ten different EI transformers with the same spec. you will end up with a collection that weighs in at say, 5lb to maybe 12lb or more and cost < $50 to maybe several hundred. Can the "goodness" be measured in DSR alone? Probably not but it may well be an indicator. Make a good green belt project for someone. . There is much more to say on this. Such as OK John get to the point and how do you choose a power transformer.(Hint I look in my junk box first).But it still much too hot and I am starting to fade away. More later…John
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Re: PS Transformers [message #9754 is a reply to message #9751] |
Thu, 03 August 2006 21:10 |
Forty2wo
Messages: 163 Registered: May 2009
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Master |
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Oh No, don’t dismiss the question. The DSR of the transformer you end up with and how that DSR will interact with your filter are very separate questions. My point is I do not choose a transformer on it’s DSR I find that if I choose a good transformer, low DSR usually happens. For example, take two transformers from Hammond the 270fx Vs the 370fx. Now the 370 is set up for multiple input voltages but that is beside the point. They are rated very close 139VA for the 270 Vs 142VA for the 370. The 370 is a much beefier transformer and cost twice as much. So what’s up with that? Want to guess witch has the lower DSR? That aside If you are trying to get close to the "rated" 150ma, which do think will run reasonably cool and not buzz like a… well you get the idea. Now if you only ask for 75-100ma the 270 may work just fine. So were dose that leave us with the DSR? Your mission should you chose to accept it…Please let us know.;) As to how to whatever DSR we end up with works into the filter. I need to research as well. First thoughts, model a simple filter. Say 10uf -5mh-50uf to a stepped load. vary the transformer DSR and take good notes. Maybe replace the choke with a resistor. When in doubt use 1k. I think there something on the VT52 site. What do you say, we work this for a week or so and compare notes?…John
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Re: PS Transformers [message #9755 is a reply to message #9751] |
Thu, 03 August 2006 21:10 |
Forty2wo
Messages: 163 Registered: May 2009
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Master |
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Oh No, don’t dismiss the question. The DSR of the transformer you end up with and how that DSR will interact with your filter are very separate questions. My point is I do not choose a transformer on it’s DSR I find that if I choose a good transformer, low DSR usually happens. For example, take two transformers from Hammond the 270fx Vs the 370fx. Now the 370 is set up for multiple input voltages but that is beside the point. They are rated very close 139VA for the 270 Vs 142VA for the 370. The 370 is a much beefier transformer and cost twice as much. So what’s up with that? Want to guess witch has the lower DSR? That aside If you are trying to get close to the "rated" 150ma, which do think will run reasonably cool and not buzz like a… well you get the idea. Now if you only ask for 75-100ma the 270 may work just fine. So were dose that leave us with the DSR? Your mission should you chose to accept it…Please let us know.;) As to how to whatever DSR we end up with works into the filter. I need to research as well. First thoughts, model a simple filter. Say 10uf -5mh-50uf to a stepped load. vary the transformer DSR and take good notes. Maybe replace the choke with a resistor. When in doubt use 1k. I think there something on the VT52 site. What do you say, we work this for a week or so and compare notes?…John
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