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Sound and Elevation [message #78635] Thu, 12 December 2013 10:59 Go to next message
Azuri is currently offline  Azuri
Messages: 315
Registered: November 2012
Grand Master
I was cooking dinner last night and part of the directions for what I was fixing stated that different oven temperatures are needed for higher elevations.

It got me to thinking. Do changes in elevation effect sound waves? ( I know, I've got a weird mind sometimes Laughing ) Where the air is thinner, do sound waves travel faster for instance?
Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78636 is a reply to message #78635] Thu, 12 December 2013 11:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
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Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

Yes, the speed of sound is different at different elevations, and at different temperatures for any other reason, for that matter. But the difference is small, at least in the temperature range you are comfortable being in.

Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78638 is a reply to message #78635] Thu, 12 December 2013 11:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Chicken is currently offline  Chicken
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Registered: August 2011
Grand Master
Wayne's got it. It makes sense that as temperature changes, the speed of sound changes.
Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78643 is a reply to message #78635] Fri, 13 December 2013 09:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Cask05 is currently offline  Cask05
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Registered: November 2013
Location: Arlington, Texas
Chancellor
Azuri wrote on Thu, 12 December 2013 10:59
Do changes in elevation effect sound waves?...Where the air is thinner, do sound waves travel faster for instance?

No, they don't: it's a function of temperature only:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_sound#Practical_formula_for_dry_air

If you've ever wondered about the speed of high performance aircraft/missiles at relatively high altitudes, it's a function of temperature at that altitude, and it's a surprise to most people that as you ascend from the earth's surface, the temperature isn't monotonically decreasing vs. altitude...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Comparison_US_standard_atmosphere_1962.svg

This also affects the performance of horn-loaded speakers that operate outside: at room temperature, speed of sound (celerity) is 1132 ft/s, while at 32 F (zero C) it's 1087 ft/s. In Texas on a hot summer day, the speed at 40 C (104 F) is about 1162 ft/s, which is about 7% faster than at zero C.

It makes a difference in crossover points using horns close to their cutoff points.


Chris
Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78644 is a reply to message #78643] Fri, 13 December 2013 10:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18786
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)

As an aside, have you ever been on a plane that showed altitude and temperature outside? It's pretty amazing how cold it is at 35,000 feet.

Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78645 is a reply to message #78644] Fri, 13 December 2013 10:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Cask05 is currently offline  Cask05
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Registered: November 2013
Location: Arlington, Texas
Chancellor
About -72F, generally speaking... Cool

Chris
Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78657 is a reply to message #78635] Sat, 14 December 2013 09:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Azuri is currently offline  Azuri
Messages: 315
Registered: November 2012
Grand Master
Temperature? I never would have guessed that. I can understand a humidity factor because the air is heavier with the moisture, but why does sound speed up as it gets hotter?
Re: Sound and Elevation [message #78660 is a reply to message #78657] Sat, 14 December 2013 12:31 Go to previous message
Cask05 is currently offline  Cask05
Messages: 16
Registered: November 2013
Location: Arlington, Texas
Chancellor
From the same Wikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_sound#Dependence_on_the_properties_of_the_medium:

"At a constant temperature, the ideal gas pressure has no effect on the speed of sound, because pressure and density (also proportional to pressure) have equal but opposite effects on the speed of sound, and the two contributions cancel out exactly."

from http://www.ndt-ed.org/EducationResources/HighSchool/Sound/tempandspeed.htm

"Temperature is...a condition that affects the speed of sound. Heat, like sound, is a form of kinetic energy. Molecules at higher temperatures have more energy, thus...sound waves can travel more quickly."


Chris
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