Here's one of the debt charts I was talking about. There's another that goes back to FDR that I can't find again. Pretty enlightening.

First off it shows the deficit going up under Carter but arrows show it going down. Plus it's blown out of proportion by it's scale. Look at the chart above. It's much more in prospective and shows the debt going on an upswing starting around Nixon to present (Not too convinced this chart is accurate either). Only slight bumps here and there. As I said before, and I believe you agreed with, this is mostly do to the economy and has nothing to do with the President. That said I agree with you that both parties are spending too much. But Reagan had to rebuild the military (money well spent in my opinion) and GW Bush has had a war, a terrorist attack (911 - no small bash to the economy)and what 3 or 4 hurricanes disasters?. Yes these have all made a difference. These were not small expenditures. The debt raised under Clinton's first term and only came down during his last term. Maybe the same will happen for Bush. I believe it will as the economy picks up again. We'll see.

Also one must consider where the money is being spent and conditions at the time.

Again, I'm not making excuses. Spending has to be cut. I have no hope in that happening. Do you? So to answer your original question. Which would I prefer Tax and Spend liberals or Borrow and spend Republicans. They both are the same. Both end up causing a crisis eventually.

But ultimately, it appears we agree, even if we disagree on the path to correction.

"I believe it will as the economy picks up again"
Until the coporate monopolistic control of our economy is cracked, nothing will change. Even if the economy upticks signficantly, the effects won't be felt at the avg middle class level. Wall street has to look beyond next quarter, immediate shareholder profits, and stock prices. The freewheeling days of the 90's set a tone where the manipulation of money became more important than the production of product and services. No capital investment or messy workers, just shuffle numbers in a database. You don't even need paper.

And the only vehicle to make that happen is government. Not going to happen.

I sincerely hope that 20yrs from now we'll look back and say GW was a visionary. But I'm afraid he'll be relegated to the bin along with Jimmy Carter.

You said:

"I sincerely hope that 20yrs from now we'll look back and say GW was a visionary. But I'm afraid he'll be relegated to the bin along with Jimmy Carter."

This defines you and me on the same side in this issue. I agree completely with this comment. Time will tell.

Thanks for the calm, clear and friendly debate.