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Re: Link to RTA [message #27907 is a reply to message #27906] Tue, 06 April 2004 15:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill Fitzmaurice is currently offline  Bill Fitzmaurice
Messages: 335
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
Don't mistake my point. First, if you've got 100dB from 60 to 80 Hz 150 feet from the stage that's a lot of bass impact, plenty enough to thump your chest and take your breath away. And yes, you do need some response capability down to 30 Hz or so, as the fundamentals are important too. But the main point of my discourse is that there is a basic misunderstanding amongst not only the general public but those in the industry as well as to what 'heavy bass' actually represents in the world of concert sound. It's an understandable situation, as until very recently it wasn't so easy to take an RTA of a live concert. With the advent of the handheld Phonic PAA2 it's a simple enough affair now, and what using one proved to me is that what is required for heavy bass in concert isn't strong fundamentals, it's strong 2nd harmonics, and that's where you need to make sure your speakers are up to the job.

The bottom line is that there are very different requirements of loudspeaker system responses for live versus recorded sources. If you want to do home theater right you need to be flat to 25 Hz minimum, while recorded music is generally adequate when flat to 35 Hz, and live-sound need only be flat to 60 Hz. Knowing that makes it a lot easier for both the home listener and the sound professional to make sensible and economical choices when either purchasing or building loudspeaker systems for their respective genres.

Re: Link to RTA [message #27908 is a reply to message #27907] Sun, 25 April 2004 21:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
adavis464 is currently offline  adavis464
Messages: 64
Registered: May 2009
Viscount
like talking to a brick wall

Re: Link to RTA [message #27915 is a reply to message #27907] Mon, 19 July 2004 17:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cowanaudio is currently offline  cowanaudio
Messages: 1
Registered: May 2009
Esquire
G'day Bill,

You wrote "recorded music is generally adequate when flat to 35 Hz, and live-sound need only be flat to 60 Hz."

I agree with the first half of this statemant, for 95% of all music, 35Hz is plenty. My home system is flat to below 20Hz, but adjusting the HPF on the X/O up to 35Hz usually does very little to the sound, for MOST music. But why-O-why should we restrict prosound to one octave higher??? It is so sad when I pay $100+ to see a live act on a $100K+ sound system, and it would have sounded better at home. Same is the case for the average cinema.

The bottom line is: BASS IS HARD TO DO RIGHT. 30Hz bass with low distortion at 100dB+ is VERY EXPENSIVE. That is why the prosound community is not interested. Are the kids driving around in their booming cars interested in sub 40Hz? You bet your bottom dollar they are! And they will open their wallets wide enough to prove the point. I have made a point of going a long way out of my way to experience every Servodrive and Aura sub installation I can. I LOVE GOOD CLEAN LOW BASS, and I know I am not alone. 80Hz punch is not what the punter wants these days. They are after the waves of pressure that lets you think you have just been spoken to by God. The rush that gives many punters just cannot be described.

For me the tickle of a sub 40Hz fundamental is addictive. I guess your mileage may vary.

Cheers


Re: Link to RTA [message #27916 is a reply to message #27915] Tue, 20 July 2004 07:15 Go to previous message
Bill Fitzmaurice is currently offline  Bill Fitzmaurice
Messages: 335
Registered: May 2009
Grand Master
The reason pro-sound need be flat to only 60 Hz or so is because that's where the requirements for live instruments lie. Live music creates sound; recorded music reproduces it, and the two genres are not the same. Your home speakers need to be flat to 35 Hz or less because the media you're listening to was mixed on speakers with that range and thus require speakers with the same characteristic for proper 'decoding'. In live sound the bulk of bass power is in the 60 to 100Hz band and therefore that is where the speakers used require the greatest output capability. Pro sound doesn't go flat to 30Hz simply because it doesn't need to. If it did then the capability would be there. Money is not a concern; not carting around excess gear that serves no purpose is.

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