So I'll just tell you how I feel about all this: I feel like the AudioRoundTable Array Speakers forum is being hijacked by a very small number of people who have an agenda, and promoting that agenda is more important to them than keeping the discussion moving along in a positive direction.

Here are two question everybody should answer for themselves: 1) Is this forum serving its purpose as the threads are now playing out, or should it take a more positive direction? 2) How can I best move it in the direction I would like to see it take?

I'm not looking for responses to this post, just answer the two questions for yourself and act accordingly.

That made me even madder!

VMPS certainly is not gonna tell the truth about these POS speakers, so WHO else but an ex VMPS owner, or perhaps a competitor who has familiarity with these drivers.
The thread started off asking about the VMPS drivers.
I wondered if THEY were the problem ?

Let's be real Fred, the people here are unlikely to buy ANYTHING.
They are builders and hobby people.

If you are worried about "stepping on the toes" of commercial interests, SHUT the place down.

I have been in this hobby 30 years, and almost ANY commercial product is considered a POS and fair game by some DIY guys.

No matter how good value a product is, a DIY guy can always do it "better for less".

An Audiophile will say "A Wilson is an awesome speaker"
A DIY guy will say "The Wilson is a cheap POS that uses a 14 dollar Vifa metal dome"

This IS a DIY forum, and I admire commercial guys for hanging out here like Danny Ritchie and Rick Craig.

And, I WISH you didn't live in Texas Fred, or I would have bought your needles array, Vifa drivers and all.

I've built a few "extreme-budget" arrays using a single centrally located tweeter, but for any array costing serious dollars my choice is always to buy the plans for a proven design by an expert like Jim, who has the knowledge, test equipment, and experienced ears needed to optimize a design. You pay a few dollars more, but you get a well designed speaker.

In that case, the irony was that the critics didn't do anything wrong, initially. They simply pointed to measurements and shootout results, and asked a lot of uncomfortable questions. The manufacturer involved turned the threads into a pissing contest by mischaracterizing the data and challenging the critics. It's a useful defense tactic to move focus off oneself by challenging the credibility of the person asking the uncomfortable questions. It was painful to watch, because the innocent were right to question what they saw, but in the end, the manufacturer was able to upset them enough to turn things around on an emotional level.

Let's let that be a lesson here. If there really is something wrong with a loudspeaker, lets not turn it into an attack of a company or an individual. We can discuss technical details without making things personal, can't we?

You said, "It sounds like a Vifa"
That honesty impressed me, because I THOUGHT you could take a bunch of crap drivers and make them sound like magic in a line array.
You taught me the line array, like any speaker, needs great drivers.

I live near Roger Russell Wayne, he has a pair of prototype line arrays for sale, but I lack the ceiling height!!

I found some OLD Pioneer Horns Wayne from the 70's using the Alnico Mahnet Pioneer Horns !!

Getting them this Thursday !
Tubes and Horns Wayne, getting little tube amp switch put in to switch to triode on the fly!

~5-7 years ago, Audio Asylum had the regular participation of scores of industry designers, builders, researchers, owners, etc. Now, there are maybe 20 willing to weather the continual attacks and arguments. Many finally decided that participating became too personal and the PR damage began to outweigh the goodwill. Others actually got banned after having public meltdowns.

And then, there were the real "shills" who actually used sock-puppet monikers to praise their own products. Members quickly sniffed out the fakes, held them up to public humiliation(as they deserved), and eventually ran them off. But, that also raised the level of suspicion against all industry types.

Which directly bled over into another type of conflict between legitimately pleased customers of a particular manufacturer, fanatical followers, and skeptics. Any factual questioning of design principals or performance claims eventually dissolved into personal attacks because owners took it as an attack on their favorite component. Then, hardcore fans felt the need to respond forcefully to every perceived nitpick and defend the honor of their favorite brand.

And so it went, round and round.

It's surprising how much bandwidth (and page space) few people can burn up bickering. Single threads ended up consuming entire pages.

Most of the discussion over time has been about building them oneself. Only recently has the discussion turned to buying someone's already manufactured or pe-manufactured kit.

Its a valid discussion either way, but each choice will have a different set of interested posters.

If you are the moderator then you should encourage the participation in either individuals who have already built their own systems from scratch, or manufacturers who are trying to sell their wares to the speaker BUYING rather than speaker BUILDING public.

The devolving of the forum has happened around these two topic possibilities.