| Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19637] |
Fri, 19 December 2003 14:22  |
akhilesh
Messages: 1275
Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (3rd Degree) |
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Hi Gang,
Any one have experience with good subwoofers that would go with a full range single driver? I am talking in the sub $800 range.
Not that i want one, but i was just curious, if i buy one for my home theater later, it may as well be one that i could play around with with my single drivers!
-aqhilesh
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19639 is a reply to message #19637] |
Fri, 19 December 2003 18:57  |
JLM
Messages: 69
Registered: May 2009
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Viscount |
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Kevin from Solar HiFi (http://www.solarhifi.com/) produces single driver speakers using the Jordan 92S with transmission line loading and recommends Adire subs (Rava, $400, for music and the Daeva, $600 with the 15 inch Tempest driver and digital amp, for HT). Don't know where you are on your audio journey, but I've looked into infinite baffle subs (inflexible), rear loaded horn subs (too BIG), transmission line subs (too complex), ported subs (don't control woofer excursion or match room gain), and for now have decided to just stay with simple sealed powered subs like the Adires.
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19642 is a reply to message #19639] |
Sat, 20 December 2003 09:59 |
hurdy_gurdyman
Messages: 416
Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (1st Degree) |
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Have you thought about open baffle subwoofers? They are some of the fastest, cleanest bass outside of a bass horn. Check them out. Dave :^)
http://www.euronet.nl/users/temagm/audio/dipolesub.htm
http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/urltrurl?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmitglied.lycos.de%2FMundU%2Faudio%2Fdipolsubwoofer.htm&lp=de_en&tt=url http://www.linkwitzlab.com/woofer.htm http://www.adireaudio.com/diy_audio/drivers/adire/dpl12.htm http://www.diysubwoofers.org/dipole/
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19644 is a reply to message #19641] |
Sun, 21 December 2003 08:06 |
JLM
Messages: 69
Registered: May 2009
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Viscount |
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I have owned the Hsu VTF-2 for 20 some months, but only use it in my (low priority) 2.1 HT system. I have no strong opinions about it one way or the other (I'm a fan of transmission lines, but they can produce too much of a good thing if you don't bi-amp). BTW I've heard Hurdy Gurdy Dave's O.B. system (above) and it does many things very well, but as a single driver/simplier the better slanted kind of guy I'm "philosophically opposed" to the equalizer, bi-amping, and 4 woofers per side he's using to provide good bass from moderately sized open baffles.
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19645 is a reply to message #19644] |
Sun, 21 December 2003 10:30 |
hurdy_gurdyman
Messages: 416
Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (1st Degree) |
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The eq biamped part is only below 60 Hz. The main speakers are run without a crossover from my tube amp, thus have nothing interfering with the signal clarity. The OB sub still produces better quality of bass then any of the sealed, ported and bandpass subs I've owned. One really needs to seriously audition OB subs to hear what they can do. It's about as close as you can get to a horn bass in clean sounding bass as it gets. The only real drawbacks are that for it to work well, more then one driver should be used, and it's rather inefficient. I use a 200 watt per channel ss amp to run the subs and it's pretty well matched to my 20 watt tube amp. I use my eq unit as part of the crossover to make a steeper roll-off. I don't really need any eq, as the speakers are pretty flat without it, but the eq zeros it in just a bit better, so I have almost a flat line when measuring in room response. One things for sure, it really sounds great.
I notice on the DIY by Bulletin Forum that OB subs are getting more popular every day as more people try them. Must be a good reason for that somewhere.Dave
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19649 is a reply to message #19642] |
Mon, 22 December 2003 08:55 |
akhilesh
Messages: 1275
Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (3rd Degree) |
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Hi Dave,
I spent some time thinking about the problem of bass below 50Hz, since that is about all you can expect rom a single driver.
I came up with the following options:
1. an active sub, like the Hsu, that takes output from the low powered tube amp used to drive the full range drivers, and then steps it down and amplifies it again.
2. A LARGE box (bass reflex) with very efficient drivers like electrovoice EVforce 15s ( i actually have a pair lying around) that will generate down to 25 HZ in a box of 20 cubic feet. These would be driven directly by the tube amp, in parallel with the full range drivers. SInce i don't have a LARGE studio at my disposal, and because of building costs for a large box, i think a powered sub would be the way to go, esp. if it is crossed at low frequencies. I am not sure if it will smear across the sound, if it is crossed low enough I do not think ti will. Also, i don't think the signal delay due to attenuation & reamplification will be at all audible to human ears.
I read a lot about the Hsu sub, and i don't see too many on sale used, so i thught they might be good. The open baffle solution you use seems a high cost/size solution to me kind of like option 1. I am sure the results are great though. If you live anywhere near Tulsa, I would love to come by and hear the setup. I am not sure about room modes not interacting just because the bass is directed in an Open baffle. I mean aren't the room modes because of the wave length? Does the directionality of the bass have anything to do with this?
One more thought: what kind of drivers do you use for the open baffle. Do they support a lot of travel? Most drivers would get damaged in open baffle, right?
thanx
-akhilesh
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| Re: Any good suggestions for subwoofers with full ranges? [message #19652 is a reply to message #19651] |
Mon, 22 December 2003 16:09 |
hurdy_gurdyman
Messages: 416
Registered: May 2009
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Illuminati (1st Degree) |
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My fullrange driver in the OB's are EV LS-12's with modded piezo tweeter horns. The woofers for the subs are just drivers I had laying around untill I can buy better ones. They still sound great, though. A pair of the 12" woofers came out of some late 70's or early 80's 4-way "Omega" speakers (bass reflex). Not sure where the other two 12's came from, but they seem to be similar. I've unhooked the 10" drivers I was using with them due to surround rot on one pair. The OB's sound just fine with 2-12"'s per baffle. I have measured a very flat response, in room, down to 30 Hz (+1 dB), about 8 dB down at 25 Hz. I plan on getting some 12 or 15 inch drivers for OB, maybe in the spring.
I've been switching back and forth between using my EV's and a pair of modded Klipsch Heresy's. They both sound good, with the EV's being more efficient and the Klipsch sounding a bit faster and more dynamic. The EV's in the OB have a bigger soundstage. I could live with either, but I tend to prefer the Heresy's for the fantastic way they do midrange. Vocals are fantastic!Dave
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