Home » Audio » Thermionic Emissions » Foreplay/Gainclone
Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8576] Sat, 27 November 2004 12:01 Go to next message
Manualblock is currently offline  Manualblock
Messages: 4973
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (13th Degree)
Finally got around to installing the Anticipation upgrade in the Foreplay. I am running that into the Brian GT clone then to the Pi 4's. Using my Rotel 991 I am getting damned good sound. For some reason the Foreplay works real well with the GC, it provides a much more powerful presentation with deep and quick bass and nice 3d mids, I have been listening to this set-up now for 2 weeks.
Tried it with my son's portable and I think you would be hard pressed to improve on that for the money.

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8577 is a reply to message #8576] Sat, 27 November 2004 12:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18670
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)
Thanks for your impressions. Sounds like a tubed CD player, in that you are incorporating a tube into the system. Maybe people with solid state gear could use a tube in-line through the preamp input/output of their existing hifi systems. What do you think?

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8579 is a reply to message #8577] Sun, 28 November 2004 09:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Manualblock is currently offline  Manualblock
Messages: 4973
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (13th Degree)
Good question Wayne. I know there is some debate as to whether using tube driven pre-amp/SS amp is of any value in terms of sound quality. I actually just stumbled on this combo. I had the Anticipation upgrade lying around for more than a year and was not using the Foreplay. Just for kicks I put it together and tried it with the GC and found the sound to be real lively and defined. It's funny because I decided to put the Carver TFM 60/ foreplay in just to see if it too would sound good and to be frank it was dull and boring.
So I thought hey; this is one cheapie combo that really sounds good this way, but I can't speak for any other systems. To be truthfull I have never been a fan of mix and match. Mostly I found you get the worst of both worlds, a sort of glaze over the sound that flatters niether the tube pre or the SS amp. I am not sure what the output impedance is on the Foreplay maybe that has an impact. I suggest anyone with an FP try it on the GC. It reminds me of the sound we got with the Stoetkit. Some of the best of Tube and SS. How's that amp working for you?

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8580 is a reply to message #8579] Sun, 28 November 2004 12:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18670
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)
I have a Foreplay with all the upgrades, mods and stepped attenuators. I also have a ton of chip amps in my parts bin so I'll have to see if I have a 3875 and connect it to the Foreplay. Isn't a 3875 the chip used in the Gainclone? That and a high current 12 volt supply (like a car battery charger) would be real easy to put together. Sure sounds worth doing!

About the Stoetkit, I haven't received the one I purchased yet. The demo model was excellent, so I'm excited to get my kit. I imagine it will be around the first of the year, since I think it is coming from Heart in the Netherlands. When it arrives, I'll post a write-up and some photos of the assembly process.

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8581 is a reply to message #8580] Sun, 28 November 2004 13:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Manualblock is currently offline  Manualblock
Messages: 4973
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (13th Degree)
You know Wayne I took the stepped attenuators out of my Foreplay; it was hard to get a good balance of output. The Gainclone can use either the 3785 or the 1875 chips. I used a toroidal transformer and hexfred rectifier diodes with Black Gate Electrolytics as a power supply. It can sound a little harsh on the real high freq. if you push it. With the Pi Theater 4's It never runs out of steam and very surprising how musical this thing sounds.
If I ever get delivery of all the parts for the Death of Zen pre-amp I will report on that combination. What a pain gathering parts; something to be said for kits!

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8582 is a reply to message #8581] Sun, 28 November 2004 13:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18670
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)
I think the best thing about kits is the single source and the fact that the kit assembler can use an economy of scale to reduce prices. OK, that was two best things.

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8583 is a reply to message #8576] Tue, 30 November 2004 12:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
GarMan is currently offline  GarMan
Messages: 960
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (2nd Degree)
JR,

Sounds like you're running something similar to Joe's JLTi tube-buffered gainclone. I found my gainclone works very well with my tube preamp too, although the bass is lacking at the very bottom end.

Here's a thought: a 4 channel gainclone for biamping purposes. Build the two HF channels a usual, but give the two LF channels about 20,000 uF of reservoir capacitance per channel. From what I've read, increasing power supply reservoir increases bass quality, but mids and HF suffers.

Gar.


Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8584 is a reply to message #8583] Tue, 30 November 2004 12:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wayne Parham is currently offline  Wayne Parham
Messages: 18670
Registered: January 2001
Illuminati (33rd Degree)
Hi Gar,

You betcha on the parallel capacitance in the power supply. Large caps like that act like batteries, and allow high current surges in excess of what the supply can provide on a constant basis. This is one place where the adage "bigger is better" definitely applies.

Wayne

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8585 is a reply to message #8584] Tue, 30 November 2004 14:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
GarMan is currently offline  GarMan
Messages: 960
Registered: May 2009
Illuminati (2nd Degree)
It's kind of fun to cut the A/C on my preamp and still have FULL volume for 30 seconds, and listen for another 10 seconds as the sound fades.

I agree, bigger is better for almost all amps. For some reason, it's not the case for the gainclone, I haven't found an explanation as to why the gainclone suffers in the mids and hi's with anything more than 1500 uF per rail, but it seems to be the word on the net.

Gar.

Re: Foreplay/Gainclone [message #8586 is a reply to message #8576] Tue, 30 November 2004 14:33 Go to previous message
Skip Pack is currently offline  Skip Pack
Messages: 51
Registered: May 2009
Location: Hollister, California
Baron
I've been using a fairly stock Foreplay into an 1875 inverted gainclone.
It works great, but I'd be a little leary of an inpedance mismatch
driving two gainclone inputs for bi-amping. If I remember correctly,
the Foreplay has an output impedance of 1.3K which suggests that you
would want 25-30K per gainclone input. Since Foreplays have a ton of
gain, a dropping tranformer might work beautifully.

Skip

Previous Topic: tube or circuit?
Next Topic: HiFi Collective review
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Thu Mar 28 15:39:59 CDT 2024

Sponsoring Organizations

DIY Audio Projects
DIY Audio Projects
OddWatt Audio
OddWatt Audio
Pi Speakers
Pi Speakers
Prosound Shootout
Prosound Shootout
Smith & Larson Audio
Smith & Larson Audio
Tubes For Amps
TubesForAmps.com

Lone Star Audiofest